Page 95 - artebrasileiros-65

our initiatives as a guideline for research interview françoise vergès [pages 50 to 53] were there. Can you say something about
and management. For the Maracá funerary this statement and Choreographies of
urns, Lucas Silva, a museology student at RADICAL IMAGINATION the Impossible?
ufpa (Federal University of Pará) developed TIME Françoise Vergès – When I said that, I
research in order to reconnect funerary urns thought it was possible to really do it the
with human remains, and the contexts in which Françoise Vergès, author of Decolonizing way we wanted, not just to show something
they were originally found (silva et al., 2021). the Museum, states in an interview that about the quilombolas and slavery, but to
Here (at mpeg), the ceramic bodies are being what is being done in major exhibitions, do it differently, very densely, so that there
reunited with their biological (osteological) such as the São Paulo Biennale, is no longer would really be change. It is not necessary
enough, and we need to go further
bodies, returning the individuality of each of to tell the story that has not been told,
these Maracá subjects who today inhabit the by fabio cypriano because this is being done, it is really to
technical reserve”. (pr: Here Dr. Helena refers change completely. And I realized that
to one of the special rooms built in the museum, With Decolonize the Museum – program it wasn›t possible because we are not
closed to the public, properly air-conditioned, of Absolute disorder (Ubu, 2023), the French free. So, the museum is not a space of
prohibited from being photographed, where activist and thinker Françoise Vergès makes freedom, it needs to be outside of it, in
more than 200 funeral urns are exposed on a a precise analysis of the current situation of a place that we would have created as
platform and, below, in cataloged drawers, lie museums which, on the one hand, seek new a place of freedom, at least for a while,
the osteological remains relating to each one” practices contrary to the colonialism that is maybe for a long time. That›s still what
(…) “With Marajoara ceramics, the approach in the very gene of their emergence, continue I think today.
yielded important reflections on the dispersion, using the same hierarchical and patriarchal At the Biennale there are things that
or exodus, of huge Marajó collections system as always. “We need to go further”, are absolutely fantastic and there is a real
distributed across several museums, as well she argues in an exclusive interview in São desire and drive for something beyond.
as on the act of displaying these funerary Paulo, at the beginning of last October, when And the fact that you have the Homeless
items to the general public.” (…) In this same she came for the launch of the publication Movement is really something close to a
context, Simas provokes us to reflect on and several conversations in several states proposal that goes beyond the field of art.
complex issues related to the conservation and across the country. But it’s still a Biennale. I’m not saying we
management of these collections, donations Under the impact of Choreographies of shouldn’t do it or that it would be bad. I
and decontextualization of collections, loan the Impossible , the first São Paulo Biennial don’t have a virus to judge, but my point is
policies and sharing of collections of objects with a majority black curatorship, in addition that we know enough today that we should
formed by fragments under the care of different to several exhibitions in the city that seek the do something else. We know enough, as
institutions.” (idem). meaning of reparation, Vergès declares: “It is we have worked on post-colonial and
Souza Lima (2020), constructed the life not enough.” decolonial strategies, on representation,
story of a Marajoara urn that was historically As she argues in the book itself, “it is analyzing images, producing texts. But we
individualized and decontextualized (souza not enough to exhibit ‘decolonial’ works are at a decisive moment in which it is really
lima, et al., 2020), as well as analyzing the (…), diversify what is hung on the walls, talk necessary to take a leap of imagination,
process of reproducing his image on various about preservation and conservation in a to escape the Western norm.
supports in Marajó and the creation of a state of permanent war against subalterns
handmade replica of it in the technical reserve and indigenous people”. It seems here that – Many people expected, since
(souza lima, 2023). In fact, the proposal to she is referring to the Masp controversies this is the first time that the Biennale’s
build life stories (of people and objects, both surrounding the Brazilian Stories exhibition curatorship has been majority black, that
understood as subjects) from the collection last year, but she says she was not aware of there would be a revolution. But when it
has shown enormous potential. the case. In fact, however, there are not many opened, people realized that it is still a
Here, for example, the photographs of differences between the arrogance of the biennial, af er all that is the rule….
Anita Ekman’s Performance (body painting French museums to which she is accustomed This is what I say: the impossibility within
with marajoara and ocher stamps) with Urna and which she reflects on in the publication the system of allowing you to go beyond
Marajoara (Joanes style) at Museu Paraense and that of Avenida Paulista. the limits. You can transform the space,
Emílio Goeldi, 2022. The book also addresses other urgent issues not put the table and chair in the same
“Beyond the walls of the technical reserve, now, such as the poor working conditions place in the patriarchal master’s house.
I see it as equally important to explore, on the reported by employees of the São Paulo And this already causes challenges to
spot, the sensitive experience of the material Biennial: “It is necessary to create a place the perspective of the way we circulate in
world of objects and constructed landscapes, where the working conditions of those who space, but the wall is still there. We haven’t
as meaningful places, to bring us closer to clean, monitor, cook, research, administer challenged the system yet. We remain
the complex webs of relationships between or produce are fully respected; where within the system. We do things differently
these materialities and human societies, in hierarchies of gender, class, race and religion and they are incredible, but as I say, it’s
the present and in the past. To achieve this, are questioned.” time to go further, because otherwise
the conventional methods of archeology and Read below some of Vergès’ reflections af er space imposes a certain way of being.
science alone are insufficient to reveal latent visiting the São Paulo Biennial and Ocupação
elements of the material universe that are, 9 de Julho, which hosts the Refoundation – Sometimes yes, but, let’s say
in some cases, essential to understanding exhibition : documenta fifteen, in 2022, was very
the knowledge, concepts and practices of surprising when rethinking the use of
indigenous peoples and other peoples of the – You wrote that, in 2011, you still spaces, because people slept and cooked
Amazon rainforest.” believed that it was possible to hold an in the museum, there was a place for
It must be said that ceramics, and other exhibition that did not physically discipline children. In my opinion, they completely
archaeological remains, speak and have a lot the quilombolas. Today I’m thinking about changed the structure.
to tell us. It’s up to us to know how to listen the São Paulo Biennial because it’s an Yes, they occupied the space they were
to them. important topic for them and I know you given in a different way, and with this

95