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managed by the institute, in the   possibilities  for  action  in  the
            perspective  of  participation    elaboration, implementation and       – Recently, iphan exonerated
            and social compliance by Ibram    monitoring of sectoral policies will  18 superintendents from almost all
            and  Brazilian  museums  in  the   be expanded.                  states in the country. This mega-
            resumption of democracy.                                         exoneration shows that there was
                                           Recently,  Ibram’s  structure     a generalized contamination in the
          What is the main orientation of   transferred  one  of  its  linked   historical heritage, doesn’t it?
          the new Ministry of Culture for   museums, Professor Mello Leitão     Leandro Grass – We had a group
          conducting  national  policy  on   Museum of Biology (mnpml), to      of superintendents who were not
          museums within Ibram’s structure?  the management of the Ministry of   at  all  in  tune  with  the  required
            Ibram has autonomy to manage   Science, Technology and Innovation,   technical  training,  with  the
            its 30 museum units. On March 2)   within the scope of the National   principles of heritage republicanism,
            the first MinC Strategic Planning   Institute of the Atlantic Forest.   with  references  that  were  very
            Seminar  was  held,  in  which   Will  this  understanding  of  the   disconnected from national policies.
            challenges and priorities for public   scope of each institution persist   To give you an idea, there were
            cultural policies were outlined,  in your management or will there   people with a monarchist profile,
            bearing in mind that the work of   be a review of the scope of each   that is, anti-republicans, as well
            secretariats and related parties   museum with these characteristics   as people completely alien to the
            will take place in a common sense.  (of biology, for example)?      sector, digital media influencers,
            The main orientation articulated in   This transfer was carried out in 2014,   as well as others linked to local
            this Seminar was the resumption   in view of political negotiations at the   churches.  These  people  were
            of democracy, dialogue and social   time, considering the profile of the   there by a political arrangement
            participation in the construction of   museum and its management. The   of  these  churches.  They  were
            public policies and the appreciation   scope of the collection and profile of   disconnected from the technical
            of culture.                       Ibram museums was defined in past   staff and training related to heritage.
                                              administrations. Any changes that   This first wave of dismissals was to
         There are museums undergoing         may arise in the current context will   give a first substantial adjustment,
          reconstruction in the country, such   be the subject of debate between   to replace technicians, specialists.
          as the National Museum, whose       institutions,  management  and    Now, there will be a second wave of
          reopening is only scheduled for 2027.   society, considering technical and   the management area. We replaced
          How will Ibram act to coordinate    social aspects.                   practically all the superintendents,
          the reconstruction efforts of that                                     there are only two lef .
          institution?                     new public policies interview [pages 22 and 23]
            Ibram  does  not  interfere  with   IPHAN WILL                   And which states are these two
            museums  that  have  their  own                                  from?
            management,  such  as  the     RESCUE TECHNICAL                     Alagoas and Paraná.
            National Museum, which is linked  PERFORMANCE
            to the Federal University of Rio de   Leandro Grass took over the Institute in   Another  visible  aspect  of  the
            Janeiro. We will act as partners,   January and is promoting the renovation of   deterioration of the federal heritage
            meeting the demands presented   all governmental cultural institutions  service was the substantial loss
            by the institution, within institutional   by jotabê medeiros    of resources. Is it possible to say
            possibilities.                                                   how big the loss was in the last
                                           leandro grass, professor, sociologist   four years?
         what are the priorities of Ibram’s   and master in sustainable development,   In discretionary expenses, the loss
          new management –   technological   cultural manager and activist linked   was somewhere around R$ 70 to 80
          updating,  restructuring  and    to the Green Party (pv) assumed the   million in the last four years. In the
          modernization  of  collections,  presidency of the National Historical   transition of government, the new
          insertion into the new global order:   and Artistic Heritage Institute (Iphan)   government recomposed the values
          what are your priorities?        on January 10th. Grass had been part   that were practiced in 2016.
            We will act on two main fronts: the   of President Lula’s Transition Group,
            restructuring of the Institute and the   coordinating the Regional Development   What  will  be  the  investment
            resumption of social participation  Technical Group.             priorities in your management?
            in public policies. Some of the   Grass’s mission is complex: to restore   There is a large set of action plans
            restructuring challenges are valuing   the capacity of the Brazilian State to act   that are being prepared in each
            the professional staff, reviewing the   in the protection of the national historic   state, each region, and these actions
            body’s organizational structure and   heritage, a task that was vilified in every   defined in their own locations will be
            internal regulations, technological   possible way during the government of   the priority for allocating resources.
            structuring and carrying out works  Jair Bolsonaro during the last four years.
            and implementing risk management   Bolsonaro even exonerated in 2020 the  You said that the heritage recovered
            plans in the museum’s heritage. In   then president of iphan, Kátia Bogéa,  the budget it had in 2016. But, since
            the context of social participation,  at the request of an allied businessman.  that time, a lot of new things have
            existing participation mechanisms   Grass gave the following interview to   been incorporated, listed, Iphan
            will be resumed and civil society’s   arte!brasileiros:          has grown a lot.
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